Likely Pass on PPD... Possible to pass PDD in two weeks?
Hello fellow licensees,
So as the title states, I just received the Likely Pass yesterday for PPD and I'm frantically trying to decide if I want to take PDD in two weeks before vacation..
To give a background, I've passed PcM, PjM, PA, and now PPD(Fingers still crossed, I never claim victory until I see the green PASS). I primarily studied Ballast, Plural Sight, the Amber Videos, Karins notes(god bless her soul), designer hacks, and Black Spectacles for PPD, So far, for PDD, I've read about half of Ballast, taken one BS Practice Test(got 50%), and started Plural Sight.
I've been told both sides of the coin: A. Taking back to back is absolute insanity and I will be doomed, and B. It's absolutely the way to go. So I'm reaching out to fellow licensees to weigh in on this. I'm primarily worried about:
-Structures - Moment/Shear Calcs
-Mechanical - Calculating loads for HVAC, etc
-Plumbing - Calculating complex piping runs, etc.
If anyone who has experience with PDD has any thoughts on this, I'd love to hear them! I'm fairly good at waving friends and family goodbye to hide away and study, and I'm ready to hammer down for two weeks, I'm just worried there's still so much content left to learn that I won't be able to absorb it all.
Thank you!
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Hi Lucas,
I was in a very similar boat to you 2 weeks ago. I passed PPD after passing PcM, PjM, PA, and CE. I decided to keep the train rolling and take PDD two weeks later. I had studied Ballast, Amber videos (watched each one twice), some BCI, and Karin's notes (agreed on blessing her soul...incredible notes!). I also took some BS practice exams and got about 50% each time I took one. I took PDD and got a likely fail...
A colleague of mine had a similar path and passed every single exam first try, and scheduled PDD two weeks after PPD and also failed. That being said, it's probably a good idea to take it (if you can afford it) and take a shot at it. If you don't pass, at least you'll know what to work on. It's a lot of pressure going into PDD, so I totally get it! I'd say add Building Construction Illustrated to your study routine. My colleague and I both agree that reading every work of that book will help you pass PDD.
Best of luck!! I'm retaking PDD in 60 days.
-Brian
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Lucas,
Here was my personal experience:
1) Took PDD 10 days after PPD. Passed both, having studied for both at the same time.
2) PDD: Had ZERO questions requiring me to calculate HVAC loads, ZERO questions on piping runs. One moment diagram question.
I think you're overthinking the level of Engineering knowledge. I found the MEP and Structural questions to be primarily conceptual in nature, dealing more with these systems' interface with architecture, and had very few actual calculation questions that were straightforward and not at the level of "calculate the shear stress at point A in truss member B." I had nothing at that level. -
David,
Congrats on the back-to-back pass! That certainly makes me feel a lot more confident, I think most of my concern is stemming form my readings of Ballast, where I'm looking at "pracitce problems" that are 3 pages long. Like I said in a previous post, I have a friend that said she had a substantial amount of calculations, but it seems like the majority of people that I've talked to have had a different experience.
Thank you for the advice!
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I also did PDD 2 weeks after PPD and passed, but it wasn't an easy 2 weeks at all. I studied harder than any of the previous efforts since it was my last test, and it paid off, but I was very uneasy about it. Like David, I did not get any questions with HVAC or pipes, and the structural questions I got were rather basic. You absolutely need to understand how or why these systems work the way they do in order to answer some of the questions, but I wouldn't worry so much about memorizing all the equations.
I'd also echo Building Construction Illustrated - look at all the drawings you can and even copy them on your own to help get the memory really in your mind. Balance that with a little of the Building Code illustrated, and throw in a page or two of Architectural Graphics Standards just to see things drawn differently. If you have the time, sit down with a whole set of drawings lying around the office and go through the details and really work on understanding what the detail is, why it is there, and how it connects to the other building pieces around it.
It really could be a flip of the coin. You might pass, you might not. I'd say if you decide to go for it, put every effort you can into the next two weeks. It will be a rough two weeks, but either way, you'll have an excellent vacation waiting for you at the end.
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Lucas,
Here's my thoughts: there may very well be a substantial amount of calculations, but, they're not the kind of calculations I think you're fearing:
-You're going to be asked to calculate costs for an assembly or building materials (similar to practice problem in Handbook)
-You're going to probably be given some calculation question where they give you a formula you've never seen before, but they'll tell you what each part of the formula is and you simply need to get that information from the drawing or info given to you, plug those values into the formula, and get your answer
-Likely will have to calculate a R- or U-value of a wall assembly
-Basic structural calculations - not "how many bolts are required in a 1/2" plate to resist 12K of shear load?" but basic. At least, that was my experience
-Might get a lighting photometric one
Based on my experience, I strongly feel you will NOT get questions asking you to size a supply duct, calculate heating/cooling loads of a building, and things that are more engineering in nature.
Final thought: let's assume I'm wrong and you will get a question at an advanced engineering level like described above. It'll be 1-2 questions like that. To me, I say is that worth significant studying effort on your part?
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Hi Lucas -- I'd schedule it for the two-week time frame if you can.
Also, Michael and David have it right -- I'm in agreement with them.
I went 6 for 6, all in ARE 5.0. I took four in about three months, then did zero exam work for a couple months, then picked things up again and studied for a little less than a month for PPD, then waited about 3 weeks and took PDD.
Although I empathize with Michael's "last exam angst" -- big time -- I have to say that I did not study all that much for PDD -- definitely not the full three weeks -- not even close. The reason for this, is that, like others have mentioned, studying for PPD gets you a looong way toward the studying required for PDD.
And as David mentioned, do not study any advanced engineering -- and, really, don't study much basic engineering. On the high end, a small handful of such questions will appear on the exam. Pretty small ROI on those efforts.
Lucas -- good luck to you. Is this your last exam?
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Kurt,
I definitely agree with you and David on the low ROI for any calculations I may have to do. The time I'll spend trying to understand how to work through equations will get me only so many points on the actual exam, and may result in more missed points. I also wondered if studying enough to pass PPD got me over the hump for PDD. I certainly have a pretty firm grasp on concepts. For instance (aside from the equations), a lot of what I'm reading for PDD is basically review for me.
This will be my 5th, leaving CE for last since I've heard it's one of the easier ones. However, if PDD doesn't go as planned, I'll go ahead and tackle CE and finish out with retaking PDD. Hopefully I can follow your lead and go 6 for 6, that's certainly very impressive! Thank you for the advice!
David,
Thank you for the bullet points! These will definitely give me direction while I'm studying. It seems like having a general understanding of how these components are sized/designed/etc might be enough to work through any problems I may have. I think at least being familiar with terms and what they mean will be crucial too. I'm also starting to learn to sort through the plethora of random details and deciding what's worth committing to memory; for instance, I assume I won't be questioned on how long a 60 Penny Nail is? Would I be correct on this?
Thank you both for all the advice and help!
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Lucas,
With respect to "details" you show know, I would recommend that you focus on details that keep water out of buildings. Look at flashing, weeps, head/jamb details, and roofing details. I believe all of these by the way are identified in the Handbook. If using Graphic Standards, think Chapter 7, which aligns itself with CSI Div 7 - Thermal and Moisture Protection. I would be familiar as well with attachment details for various building materials and structural attachment details (I.e. a moment connection vs. a hinge connection).
You "might" get a couple of questions that are in the realm of "how long is a 60 penny nail," although probably not THAT exact one. I think on PDD, I came across two questions falling into that realm of detail at most where I was like, "Really NCARB? You're asking me THAT?" Take your best guess at those and move on with your life. You might surprise yourself and know the answer anyway.
Main thing for PDD that you must go into that exam with is navigating a set of construction documents and knowing how they get impacted when changes occur. Be able to answer the question, "an owner decides that he wants to change System X into System Y. What drawings does the Architect have to revise?" or "an owner decides that he wants to change System X into System Y. Which consultant drawings must also be revised to accommodate this change?" As far as how you go about studying that, honestly, there's no book out there to study for this. It comes from work experience I feel. If you've done this in your work, you should be able to do it on the exam.
Also understanding how drawings and specs relate to one another.
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Hey David,
I know Karin's Notes have been floating around in the ARE Facebook group quite a bit, so you should be able to find a post she made where you're able to download them. Please let me know if you have any trouble finding them and I can make sure you get a hold of them, I found them to be essential.
And I should have done a follow up! I planned on taking it two weeks later; however, I wasn't able to get the date that I needed. So instead I waited until after the wedding - which may have helped since I got the Pass! Now I'm onto my last test in Mid November. -
Lucas,
That's great to hear, best of luck with your last exam. Did you find in fact that the calculations you had to do were not difficult, engineering-type calculations? I've always tried to help steer people away from thinking that way and it's always good to get feedback from people that have just taken the test.
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Thank you! And you were totally correct, I had barely any calculations. It certainly seemed like the tests were trying to get test takers to understand implications of the equations, not how to perform them. I'm definitely planning on suggesting similar tactics to others in my studio taking these tests. Understanding the equations is important, but spending copious amounts of time on them seems like an inefficient use of time.
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