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    Jonathan Chertok

    beyond the obvious of course...

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    David Kaplan

    Other than going into the building and looking for sprinkler heads - nope! 

    Only thing I could think of is, if you're given the total square footage of the building, construction type, number of stories, height, and frontage, but no info is given about sprinklers, and then you run the calcs on an unsprinkled building using Table 503 and it doesn't pan out, you could then make an educated assumption that the building is probably sprinkled. 

    I strongly feel you won't have to do anything like this, or make such assumptions on the ARE.  They'll either tell you it's sprinkled, or say in the question something like "what would you recommend to an owner who wants to build an all-wood building of this use and this big" and the answer might be "install a sprinkler system."

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    Julie Brown

    Check the plans for a Fire Riser room?

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    Theodore Diamond

    If you're not told that the building is fully sprinkled, I would say that you should assume that it's not.  Even if you see sprinkler heads, you can't be sure that the building is fully sprinkled.  As David says, the exam will tell you.

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    Jonathan Chertok (Edited )

    hi all
    thanks for the help as always. i’m quite sure (well, within the confines of what i consider to be the “architectural equivalent” of a american ninja warrior course...) that there was no stated determination of sprinklering within the context of table 508.4.
    assume as theodore indicates that the building is unsprinklered?
    or presumably within the confines of that particular example it won’t matter whether it is sprinklered or unsprinklered since the /value/ in each table is the same...?!
    thanks
    jon

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    David Kaplan

    Jon,

    I say this with 100% certainty and 0% doubt - when asked to use Table 508.4 on the ARE, you will absolutely know going into that question whether or not the building is sprinkled. Period.  There is no way whatsoever that they would ask you a question regarding that table and not give you this information, because the answer is entirely determinant on two factors: the use groups and whether or not the building is sprinkled. 

    I'm here to politely, nicely, and gently tell you that on whatever question you came across that you felt otherwise, you somehow missed it. 

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    Jonathan Chertok

    david. how would you know for certain? also, you are stating it would be written in the program as “building is sprinklered/unsprinklered” or...?!

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    David Kaplan

    I say this because there's no way to use that Table unless you know that information.  The ratings differ based on sprinkled/non-sprinkled.  The ARE is not going to present you with a question that you can't answer.

    The only instances that I had to use that table were in my case studies.  Somewhere within the body of information and references about the building in question, it told me whether or not it was sprinkled.  Might not've been in the exact question pertaining that table.  The question would likely have just been "what is the required rating between X and Y Uses?"  I then had to search through the info and references given to me until I found out whether the building was sprinkled or not.  Point is - I found it.  You won't have an instance where you won't find it.  I promise you.  It's there. 

    Another variation to that same question might be "the owner is considering sprinkling the building.  What would the required rating be between X and Y uses?"  In some fashion, you will be told this. 

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    Jonathan Chertok (Edited )

    hi david.

    again thanks as always.

    so the post is of course to find out /where/ this information would be in the event it is not specifically stated in the program - as it is in ALL the IBC Commentary Examples.

    i am saying it is not stated explicitly in the program and i don't believe it is in the "usual suspects" (RCP or whatever) which is why i am asking the question....

    and i am starting to suspect it is not in fact stated and not in fact anywhere but that the way the question is "formulated" means it doesn't MATTER since both columns provide the same resulting /value/. or maybe i am transposing things and the fact that i didn't have access to chapter 3 to make a determination on SUB-occupancies was irrelevant since both of those ROWS provided the same value.

    who knows?

    half of this exam (as others have stated) is trying to figure out what they are asking you. i would argue another third is rooting around trying to find information that would otherwise normally be presented explicitly (and is not).

    the only caveat i can imagine is that somehow the building construction type dictates that it is sprinklered or unsprinklered. but since i may not have worked on the building type i was given in a particular case study i don't really have any way of determining this other than to ask so i (and others) don't spend inordinate amounts of time trying to find something that isn't there.

    REGARDS

    jonathan

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