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    Ryan NCARB (Edited )

    Hey Remi,

    Information related to pass rates for all divisions will not be released until the July time-frame.  Pass rates will continue to fluctuate between now and then as more and more people test in each division. The initial pass rates for PPD were in line with historical pass rates.

     

    And Darguin, I am sorry but your assumption is not founded in any real data, only limited anecdotal information posted on forums. Both people that transitioned from ARE 4.0 to ARE 5.0 and brand new testers in ARE 5.0 passed this division.  People that transitioned from ARE 4.0 to ARE 5.0 and brand new testers in ARE 5.0 also failed this division.  I caution you against making broad generalizations and assumption like that.

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    Darguin Fortuna (Edited )

    Good question Remi.

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    Remi Yasui

    Thank you very much Ryan. 

    And yes Darguin, Ryan is correct. I actually transitioned from 4.0 to 5.0 and still failed PPD. I do not think the pass/fail had any correlation between those who transitioned and those who didn't. Just like the 4.0 tests it came down to how well you were able to answer the questions. The only difference with 5.0 is that is was less memorization and more of knowing how to apply the information you were given to different situations. 

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    Darguin Fortuna (Edited )

    I pulled those comments from my crystal ball. Not meaning them to be a scientific rule to follow. My apologies if the freedom of expression from such comments might have caused any trouble. In fact I am updating them as I find them proven wrong.

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    Jonathan Chertok

    hi guys,

    speaking of freedom of expression - is there a way to have an off list conversation with someone in the 5.0 forum as there was in the 4.0 forum?

    i'm trying to learn a new system here!

    THANKS

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    Jonathan Chertok

    hi guys,

    also, what was the correction here? the issue was whether people that were transitioning to 5.0 from 4.0 did better or worse than people that went to 5.0 with no 4.0 testing?

    i don't mean to bring up an issue but the post got edited and i am having a real hard time trying to figure out whether i should move to 5.0 for this exam.

    THANKS

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    Ryan NCARB

    Jonathan,

    I am not sure what edits you are referring to.  Remi's original question and my response don't appear to be edited and are both still accurate.  Those are the important parts of this thread.

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    Jonathan Chertok

    hi ryan,

    i'm interested in passing results on 5.0 for 4.0 testers for obvious reasons.

    can i ask you if it is reasonable to expect to study the remainder of the MC material for the 4.0 exams and go into the two 5.0 exams well prepared and be prepared for the two 5.0's multiple choice questions - assuming you have passed the three 4.0's?

    can i ask if you think it is a valid strategy to stay in 4.0 and complete the three relatively focused 4.0 exams because you like the way they are specifically FOCUSED on specific topics or if simply studying for the remainder of 4.0 exams will put you in shape for being prepared for the two 5.0 multiple choice exams despite the fact that they are covering a MUCH broader range of material?

    to my eyes this is one of the very difficult issues to resolve in making the transition and/or completing 4.0.

    regarding the edits you appear to be correcting something in one of darguin's posts which i don't see in his post. and he mentions that he is "updating them" as he "finds them proven wrong". your response is below but i don't see what it is correcting or what it means:

    "And Darguin, I am sorry but your assumption is not founded in any real data, only limited anecdotal information posted on forums. Both people that transitioned from ARE 4.0 to ARE 5.0 and brand new testers in ARE 5.0 passed this division.  People that transitioned from ARE 4.0 to ARE 5.0 and brand new testers in ARE 5.0 also failed this division.  I caution you against making broad generalizations and assumption like that."

    are you indicating that there is no discrepancy between 4.0 transition tester passing results for 5.0 exams as compared to "5.0 only" testers? are you indicating this information is not tracked? 

    i'm not following and it seemed like a very important response.

    THANKS

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    Remi Yasui

    Jonathan, 

    I can't speak for NCARB but pretty sure even if they had that info they would not be able to share it because they eventually will be phasing out 4.0 and everyone will have to take 5.0. 

    However as someone who took both 4.0 and 5.0 perhaps I can help provide some insight. In my experience 5.0 was an overall better testing interface and system. The questions require more analytical thinking rather than memorizing which is what 4.0 was mostly about. All the reference information is provided for you in 5.0 so the test is about knowing how to apply the information given to specific situations which is more realistic to actual architectural practice (ie. No one actually memorizes the IBC because it changes every few years anyways.) The only downside of 5.0 for me was the time. Because you are provided with so much reference material to read through for each question, it takes a lot longer than just a standard memorization question in 4.0. There are also a lot more calculations and questions with multiple parts. In 4.0 I never felt pressured by the timer but during both 5.0 exams I barely finished even with the extended 4 hour testing time. 

    At the end of the day its really up to you whether you want to switch or not. If you liked the format of 4.0 and don't mind taking 7 tests than I say just finish it. If you hated the vignettes and are open to taking a new testing format / cutting down to 5 exams than switch. Hope this helps! 

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    Jonathan Chertok

    hi remi

    thanks.

    i like the idea of studying for BS, SS and BDCS and taking multiple choice on this. i do well with MC and would appreciate studying this material. don't see any problems passing 3 MC in 4.0. had plenty of time in MC in 4.0.
    i dislike studying for vignettes and have seven of them i would have to tackle. i took three, passed two but have no idea what i did wrong for the one i need to retake. upside is i had plenty of time to check, re-check and triple check this vignette but this is a double edged sword as you can imagine.
    not crazy about trying to wrap my head around a new testing. not crazy about being pressed for time. not crazy about not knowing if testers passed this exam or not when i get feedback on this issue.

    maybe i can just study for 4.0 SS, SD and BDCS retake CDS - hopefully pass and make a decision then? i am assuming i need to pass CDS before moving to 5.0.

    would this put me in a good position (passing 4.0 and /studying only the remaining information for the other 4.0 exams) to take the two 5.0 in your opinion?!
    does this strategy (studying now and waiting to make the decision) sound like a good one to you?!
    THANKS

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    Ryan NCARB

    Jonathon,

    The post by Darguin had originally made an assumption about the pass rates for those that have already tested in ARE 4.0 vs. those that were taking their first test in ARE 5.0.  He has since edited that post - which is fine!  Remi's original question about releasing pass rates and my response are both still accurate.

    Remi has also provided some good advice on making the transition from ARE 4.0 to ARE 5.0.  I noticed you have been asking the same thing of a lot of people on a lot of threads in both the ARE 4.0 and ARE 5.0 communities.  At the end of the day, you need to make that decision for yourself and then you just need to do it.  If you are sticking with ARE 4.0 because that is what you are comfortable with, great!  Schedule your remaining exams and take them.  If you want to transition to ARE 5.0, then also great!  Study and schedule those exams.  All the advice in the world from others can't make the decision for you.

    I hope this is helpful and in some way encouraging.  I have faith you can do this.

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    Jonathan Chertok (Edited )

    hi ryan,
    thanks for the info.
    unfortunately this is far from a straightforward decision and i am finding it hard to get information to convince me one way or another. it also involves a lot of money and a lot of time so i want to make sure i make the right decision. presumably this is what both of the forums are for.
    let me ask you this:
    1. do i need to take CDS and pass before i can schedule anything wrt 5.0?
    2. if so, is it possible to simply study for 4.0 SS, BS and BDCS /now/ and make a decision about transitioning to 5.0 /later/ after i pass?
    3. in your opinion does taking and passing PPP, CDS and SPD - and then studying for SS, BS and BCSD in 4.0 put you in good position content wise for 5.0? if yes, would you add anything to the studying?
    4. results for testers in PPP will be forthcoming and passing rates for PPD/PPP will be released in july? but so far in PPD you are seeing "historically similar" (?) passing rates? i guess this means that passing rates for PPD fall between the lowest and highest reported results in the 4.0 exams?
    THANKS

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    Darguin Fortuna

    Jonathan,

    I can understand your frustration and I can relate to your comments regarding the transition and the scores. I have some opinions regarding PPD and the cut score and in my opinion Ryan hit the spot. Both people who transitioned and people who are first time testers in general both have failed PPD fair and square regardless of their experience and study time. I would say the cut score for PPD is pretty high but not as far as a score report might show. I also believe that many people who failed were 4-10 points away from an overall passing grade this is just from looking at my fail and doing some simple math. I did horrible but the score report misleads me regarding how far I was in reality. I encourage those who fail to not over think things, focus on the things they did not do well on and retest asap.

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    Shawn Viator

    This question is for those ARE candidates who have received 5.0 exam results:

    If you received a FAIL, are the 5.0 exam results more informative than those posted for the 4.0 exams?

    Thanks in advance for responding :)

    Shawn

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    Darguin Fortuna

    They tell you something you might already know after combining the fact that you failed with any sort of feedback. Ryan   can I share my score report screenshot in here? Would that violate anything? I would like to help Shawn to get a feel for it.

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    Ryan NCARB

    Darguin,

    Sharing your score report is entirely up to you!  NCARB however will not share someone's results.

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